Hear how the unexpected intersections of comms and hospitality shaped this communicator’s approach to storytelling.
People in communications know that success requires more than just strong writing skills. It takes an ability to think outside the box to get the message out and exceed our goals.
This week on Ampersand, we’re joined by Samantha Rae Ayoub, Vice President of Communications and Knowledge Mobilization at the Stem Cell Network. While her work supports groundbreaking research in regenerative medicine, our conversation takes a different turn—into the world of leadership, empathy, and the unexpected intersections of communications and hospitality.
Sam shares her non-linear career path, from science communications to restaurant ownership, and how those experiences shaped her approach to storytelling, de-escalation, and mobilizing knowledge for researchers, policymakers, and the public.
This transcript was created using speech recognition software. While it has been reviewed by human transcribers, it may contain errors. Please review the episode audio before quoting from this transcript and email media@emdashagency.ca with any questions.
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Caitlin Kealey: Hey, and welcome to Ampersand, the podcast helping good people be heard and comms people be better. I'm Caitlin Kealey, the CEO of Emdash.
Megana Ramaswami: And I'm Megana Ramaswami, Senior Strategist at Emdash.
Caitlin Kealey: So this week, we're joined by Samantha Rae Ayoub, the Vice President, Communications and Knowledge Mobilization at the Stem Cell Network, which is a pretty cool place.
Megana Ramaswami: That is such a cool title. I love that. And I've heard that Stem Cell Network is doing some very cool work in regenerative medicine, which sounds like the most fascinating field. What did you guys talk about?
Caitlin Kealey: Well, I didn't have the time to ask her about regenerative medicine. Cause I think the podcast would have gone on for hours, but we did talk more about leadership and how to do it with empathy.
She's a bit of a communications powerhouse. So it was neat to kind of get the background of how she ended up where she is today.
Megana Ramaswami: I can't wait to hear all the tidbits of information from this. Cause it's such a cool organization and a very neat topic. So let's get into it.
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Caitlin Kealey: So we like to get started with an icebreaker question. Um, can you share a memory from your first computer or your early days on the internet?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yes and in actual fact, uh, my mom just reminded me of this memory a couple of weeks ago.
Um, so the early days of the internet, I was probably late in high school, maybe like later grades in high school. And we had dial up at the time. So we had one family computer in my childhood home and it was, like, there was no place for a computer, really, like where are you going to put it?
Like, in the kitchen, in the family room, it just wasn't set up, um, to have a computer. So we ended up having the computer sort of in this double door closet, like you opened the closet and then there was a computer desk with the computer on it and it sort of plugged, you know, plugged into the modem or whatever, and it was dial up.
And so, um, I guess what had happened, we were, we were allowed on the computer for short periods of time after school to do like word processing stuff, type up your assignment, and you know, sometimes instant messaging. Well, I guess one of us five children left the internet on, and of course you can't call home, like the phone doesn't work.
And so my mom came into the house. Like thinking something was wrong because the phone, she was trying to call for like three hours, get us to, you know, start dinner and do our afterschool chores and whatever, and no one was answering. Obviously this was before cell phones. So she just had no clue what was happened, what had happened to us at all.
And, um, it's quite a funny story. Now, my brothers and I were in a lot of trouble at the time, but, uh, yeah, that was one of my, early memories, like, you know, turn off the dial up and go back to the landline kind of thing.
Caitlin Kealey: I like that you didn't throw whoever it was under the bus.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah. You know what? I probably would if I remembered, but I don't know who that was.
It could have been me. I'm sure it was one of my brothers, but it could have been me.
Caitlin Kealey: I didn't know you had four other siblings. That's a big family.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm a blended family, so all told I have five brothers and a sister. It's, uh, it's crazy.
Caitlin Kealey: You're your own party bus. Um, do you want to tell me how you got started in communications?
I don't actually know, even though we've known each other for years. So I'm curious.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, for sure. Um, well, it's, it's kind of an interesting story. It's a bit of a non linear path, um, my career path, as I guess, you know, many are. Um, I started out because I originally thought I wanted to be a journalist or a writer.
Um, when I was a kid, I was always writing short stories and I was really creative with, you know, developing cards and things like that. I thought maybe I wanted to develop cards for Hallmark or something one day. Um, but when I did my undergrad, I ended up taking Mass Communications for my undergraduate studies.
And I found myself strangely drawn more towards the topics about like how people receive and interpret messages and communications, um, how people develop and learn languages, uh, things like conflict resolution, um, propaganda studies, that sort of stuff. I was honestly much less interested in like marketing, advertising, media relations.
Still not a huge fan of media relations. I think that's why you and I are friends. Um, but at the same time, like as most young people do, um, I was also working in hospitality, like specifically in restaurants, uh, to pay the rent, to pay for my schooling. Um, and, uh, you know, I, you learn very quickly when you work in customer service, how to actually communicate face to face, with people. Um, and having that face to face communication and the words that you say, you know, is, is exceptionally important.
And if you fast forward a little bit, I, within a couple of years, very quickly found myself into parallel careers. And I think, you know, this part. Um, so. One career was as a communications professional, um, kind of early days. And then the second career was actually as a restaurant owner. And then when people hear that, they're like, what?
That's so bizarre and very unconnected. Um, and while they might be unconnected and completely different career paths, what I've realized over the years is that they were actually really complimentary and they sort of helped me become the communications professional that I am today. Um, you know, the, the face to face time that I got with, with customers, um, the ability to learn, you know, leadership skills and de-escalation techniques, like right, kind of in the moment helped me become a better communications professional.
And then the items that I learned in, as a communications professional, marketing strategies, um, interpersonal communication techniques, all of that sort of thing helped me become a better restaurant owner. So, as I said, um, a little bit of an odd career path, but, uh, kind of made me who I am today.
Um, but if we dive a little bit deeper into the communications profession, uh, I was kind of always in science communication. Um, I started out, uh, originally in, within the government in the office of the National Science advisor at the time. It was an administrative role, but it really, um, helped me connect with a lot of really important people. And I got access to, you know, exceptionally groundbreaking science happening across the country.
Really interesting stuff. Um, and then I moved after that, uh, to the Council of Canadian Academies. I think that's where you and I first, um, started working together. And the Council of Canadian Academies works on all different kinds of science, very broadly defined, uh, works with expert panels to kind of put out these state of the nation reports.
Um, and, uh, that was a really great opportunity to, again, meet some really brilliant scientists and researchers and dive into all different kinds of, of science and think about how to communicate that out to the public and to policymakers. And then, uh, for a little while I, I was a consultant and, uh, I stayed sort of in the science communication space.
I had a couple of different clients, including the National Research Council. And then just about three years ago, I moved over to the Stem Cell Network, which is where I am now.
Caitlin Kealey: Thanks. That was very thorough. And, uh, I think, you know, hospitality and comms go hand in hand. When we first started, we only hired people that had hospitality backgrounds.
We've further extended past that. But, you know, when you hire somebody that's dealt with customers. They are very good at de-escalating and all sorts of things. So I see it. I get it. Um, do you want to talk a little bit about your experience in knowledge, mobilization and communications, given all the different roles that you've just outlined?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, sure. Um, so I guess, uh, I'll, I'll start maybe where I currently am. So at the Stem Cell Network. So, uh, the Stem Cell Network is, uh, a national organization and, and we kind of, do four things. So the first thing is we fund stem cell and regenerative medicine research across the country. We train next generation talent.
We work to enhance knowledge mobilization of that research, which is where I come in mostly. And then, um, we're also building out a, a new commercialization readiness program to make sure that when research is ready to be developed into, you know, therapies, that it can actually someday make it out to patients and into the marketplace.
So that's in a nutshell. what the organization does. Um, my team is very focused on all aspects of what you would imagine a traditional communication shop would be. So that's anything from internal to external communications. Um, of course, social media and websites. Um, we develop out a lot of our publications and then we have this Um, bucket of activity or program, um, for knowledge mobilization.
And we define that pretty broadly, but, um, we think about it in sort of three parts. So, knowledge mobilization for research, and that is, is my team helping researchers across the country elevate and highlight their work. So that might be telling a story, getting something into the newspaper, helping them showcase a new piece of research or a new publication, maybe getting them to be a speaker at an international conference.
That sort of thing. Um, we also do knowledge mobilization sort of in the policy area and this is really just helping translate research for policy and decision makers so that they can make informed decisions or have the latest, um, information about stem cells and regenerative medicine research and what's happening across the country.
And then we do knowledge mobilization for, um, for patients and for the public. So that's about providing the best information, the most accurate information, answering people's questions about the potential of the research and what's happening, um, in the labs and in the hospitals across Canada.
Caitlin Kealey: Cool. Thanks. That's, uh, that's a long list of your, your knowledge is fully mobilized It sounds like.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: I hope so. Cause you know.
Caitlin Kealey: What do you love about doing your job? Like what is it that floats your boat?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: I think what gets me most excited about my current role. And one of the reasons I came to the Stem Cell Network was that I get to focus on one area of science, right?
Like I don't have to learn all the different topics like I had perhaps in, in previous roles. I just get to focus on what's happening in the world of regenerative medicine and I get to connect with those researchers and the thing that gets me most excited is actually going into the labs and talking to the researchers and seeing what they're up to.
And what I love about that is that every researcher I have met in the network to date, I'm not kidding, has been over the moon and has totally given me the time to explain whatever it is that I'm that they're researching. Um, they don't mind that I come into the lab. They don't mind that, you know, I take pictures and video of them.
They don't mind that I'm not an expert, and they're more than happy to take the time to explain, not just their research and exactly what they're doing, perhaps. Um, on the bench, but what it means for Canadians and what it means for, for patients and how it's going to translate. Um, and I think one of the things that excites me as a communications professional, and it was something that I didn't know when I first joined the Stem Cell Network is, there is, you know, vast potential for stem cell and regenerative medicine.
And a lot of people, like, I don't know what your opinion is or what you think, um, at the moment, but a lot of people think stem cells and they think cancer treatments and bone marrow transplants, right? And there's so much more than that. Um, you know, people are doing work in muscular dystrophy and multiple sclerosis and neurodegenerative diseases.
And so being able to connect with the researchers and understand exactly what they're working on and then help them sort of translate that into stories that will be, um, meaningful for the average, you know, member of the public or politician or patient or family, um, is really excited. Like, that's what, that's what gets me excited.
Caitlin Kealey: That's awesome. Yeah. I worked in research comms and higher ed comms for years, as you know. And, uh, yeah, I, the nerdy stuff is my favorite as well. And then translating it into stuff that is accessible for the wide public, wider public. Um, can you share an example of something that you've done while you were at the Stem Cell Network that you're proud of that went really well?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, I think, um, there's two things, but they're kind of similar. So the first thing is a project that we sort of recently undertook and it's called Stem Cells from the Sofa. And the reason I'm proud of it is because we took an idea and we sort of reformatted it and rethought it, repackaged it to be for a different audience.
And so I'll explain a bit. Um, before I came to Stem Cell Network and, um, during the COVID 19 pandemic, um, the Stem Cell Network had created this little webinar series called Stem Cells from the Sofa, but it was for researchers and it was by researchers because during the pandemic, of course, we were all on lockdown, no one was going to conferences, researchers couldn't share their research with one another.
So Stem Cells from the Sofa was this webinar series that gave researchers a platform to share kind of what was up and coming, what they were working on, and people could tune in. So for researchers by researchers. Then, um, in 2022, 2023, that, there was really no longer a need for that. People were returning to conferences, they were sharing their work in person, um, and travel resumed.
But we still liked this idea and this, this concept of telling stories, kind of, about stem cells and regenerative medicine and their potential from a sofa. And so we did a little bit of polling and we talked to our patient committee and we began to understand that the public and um, patient groups and people who um, like family groups really have um, questions, like just basic questions about what are stem cells, what's their potential?
What kind of disease areas? Um, are researchers working in? How do you get into a clinical trial? What is a clinical trial? How do they work in Canada? Like all of these basic questions. So we completely overhauled this series, totally rebranded it and then made it into these sort of little five to eight minute clips where someone from my team interviews a, you know, live researcher and they ask these kinds of questions back and forth.
And it's designed to be consumable by, you know, you, me, an average member of the public.
Caitlin Kealey: I love the accessibility, right? It's all about how do you tell the stories in a way that people understand and can sort of see the value.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah.
Caitlin Kealey: Um, speaking of COVID and the rise of misinformation and disinformation, which is not what you were talking about at all, but I'm just going to use that as a segue.
Um, what do you see as the role of science communications in today's, uh, very somewhat, perhaps, misinformed social media world that we are functioning within, whether we like it or not?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, good question. Very meaty. We could talk, we could do a whole other podcast on this. Um, but I guess I would say a couple of things.
Um, the role of a science, of a science communicator, or really a communications team, um, that is focused on, on research and, and communicating science of any kind. Um, I think first and foremost is about providing factual information. So make sure that the facts about whatever it is that your organization is doing are accessible, whether it's on your social media channels or on your website, whatever the windows into your world is, make sure it's there so that people can find it.
I think it is important to call out misinformation when you see it. I do think it's a challenge for organizations to constantly be combating misinformation and disinformation. That's a whole job in and of itself. And what has worked for us, um, because we definitely focus at the Stem Cell Network about making sure that we have accurate, concise, information that's easily accessible on the website.
You know, people can write us if they have a question, we answer. Um, so having that information available is one thing, but then, you know, working with partners to put that who are really great and whose role it is to be out there to combat misinformation and disinformation, um, is a great idea. And we've done this in the past at Stem Cell Network.
I'll give a shout out to ScienceUp first. We partnered with them um, a couple of times over the last uh, couple of years to really share accurate information about stem cells and regenerative medicine and the potential of the research. Um, and they do a really good job at, um, particularly on social media about getting the word out about this kind of thing.
I guess the other thing I would say, is when you're developing the communication, so before you even get to publishing it online, um, and actually making sure that it is accurate and concise is critically important. And so what I tell my team, what I have always said to any communications professional that works in this space, is science communication and communication about research cannot only be done by communications professionals.
It needs to be done in collaboration with researchers and with scientists. And you need to very much work together back and forth to get to a place that is in the middle of, you know, not being completely jargon filled and lengthy, but also not being so headline or tweet worthy, that it's actually, you know, too concise and it makes it inaccurate.
There needs to be a middle ground where you're providing enough information and it is, um, factually correct. It's digestible by a member of the public and it's clear. So that's, that's normally what I would focus on.
Caitlin Kealey: Yeah. I mean, it's such a fine line between, you know, being, being click baity, but actually giving value, right?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, absolutely.
Caitlin Kealey: And I mean, it's interesting, right? Because in the world of misinformation, the rules aren't the same, right? Like the Stem Cell Network has to function with a level of integrity that, you know, the evil doers don't really have to play by the same rules. So it causes an extra challenge.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah, it is a very, um, it's a very tricky, um, place to wander into.
I mean, you could be, you could be attempting to combat misinformation and disinformation all day. And so for us, the starting point certainly is making sure that, you know, the information that we are providing is correct and is digestible so that we can, we can loop back to it. And then, you know, calling out information when, and, if and when we see it.
Caitlin Kealey: It's like, extreme whack a mole.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Yeah! Yes, it is.
Caitlin Kealey: Um, so we often, often, we always close on, uh, this final question, so I will throw it to you. If you had one piece of advice for someone who wanted to excel in your field, what would you tell them?
Samantha Rae Ayoub: Oh, this is a good question. Um, I normally, I normally kind of say two things.
So I do a lot of mentoring of people who are coming up in the field of communications and I, I usually get two questions. Um, one of them is about, you know, should, should someone early on really choose a specialty? I don't know if you thought about this when you were starting out in your career or not.
I wasn't, yeah, I wasn't, it wasn't front of mind for me. But what you're shaking your head. So you're both like, no. Um, But it's something that gets asked of me a lot. Now, how do I choose a specialty? What if I choose the wrong one? Um, do they go into media relations or internal communications or digital or marketing?
What have you? And my answer is always this. The field of communications is massive and it's, ever evolving. Um, choosing a specialty for some people might work. And for other people like you and me, we just, you know, kind of find our career path as we, we go through it. Um, it's, uh, if you're not sure what kind of communication role that you want to go into, what I typically tell folks is maybe try out like an agency or a nonprofit for a while.
They tend to be very, you know, um, all hands on deck sort of powerhouse teams, you get access to a lot of stuff. Um, and you get to try out a lot of different types of comms in a really short period of time. So you'll be able to figure out what you might like or what you gravitate towards and what, what you don't.
Uh, so that's, that's one piece of advice that I typically give. Um, and then also sort of saying like, don't worry about it. Like, you'll, you'll figure out your specialty, like, as you go. You have lots of time in the, in the field of comms. Um, the second question that I get a lot of the time is how do you climb the ladder, um, and, and, you know, lead a team when you might not be an expert in all aspects?
Of, you know, communications or leading that team. And, um, I also typically say, you know, just like you don't have to choose a specialty. Like, you also don't need to be an expert in absolutely everything to successfully lead a team. Like, I don't know about you, but I'm definitely not an expert in all things comms.
Caitlin Kealey: Oh, my God. I hire people that are better at me in almost everything. So then I don't have to do it, and they get to do it.
Samantha Rae Ayoub: This is exactly the advice, and so what I say is, you know, focus on building, like, your sustainable skills, like, your leadership skills, you know, project management, conflict resolution, interpersonal communication, strategic thinking, like, all of that stuff.
Focus on that. Um, as you, you know, climb the ladder to become a leader. And then, like what you said, hire people around you who are better at doing the things that you don't know how to do. So one, you can learn from them. Two, you can empower them to do those things. And then, you know, you can, you can lead the team towards, you know, doing excellent work.
Caitlin Kealey: Well, that's it for this week's episode of Ampersand. Thanks for joining us.
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Ampersand is hosted by Megana Ramaswami and me, Caitlin Kealey, and it's produced by Elio Peterson. This podcast is a project of Emdash, the small agency focused on big impact helping progressives be heard.